Affordable Dual Core from AMD: Athlon 64 X2 3800+
by Anand Lal Shimpi on August 1, 2005 9:36 AM EST- Posted in
- CPUs
AMD's Efficiency Advantage?
Before we get to the actual barrage of performance tests, there is one issue that we have been wanting to tackle for quite some time now.AMD has often argued that their dual core architecture is inherently more efficient than Intel's, primarily because of their System Request Queue (SRQ). All core-to-core transfers occur via this queue instead of over a main, shared FSB, which is the case in the Pentium D.
Johan put AMD's architecture to the test by measuring the latency of cache-to-cache transfers in AMD's dual core chips vs. Intel's. The results were quite impressively in favor of AMD's architecture. Cache-to-cache transfers on Intel's dual core CPUs took over twice as long as on AMD's dual core CPUs, but at that time, we could not find any real world benefit to the architecture.
Armed with a bit more time, we went through all of our benchmarks and specifically focused on those that received the most performance gain from dual core architectures. Using these multithreaded and/or multitasking benchmarks, we looked at the performance improvements that the dual core processors offered over their single core counterparts. For AMD, making this comparison was easy; we took the Athlon 64 X2 3800+ and compared it to its single core equivalent, the Athlon 64 3200+. For Intel, the comparison is a bit more complicated. The inclusion of Hyper Threading makes the single-core to dual-core jump a little less impressive in some cases, thanks to the fact that virtually all single-core Pentium 4 processors these days can execute two threads simultaneously. Thus, for Intel, we had to look at HT enabled, dual core and dual core with HT enabled, all compared to single core performance to get a complete picture of Intel's multithreaded performance scaling.
Remember that all performance increases are with reference to a single core processor, and in the case of Intel, we are talking about a single core Pentium 4 with HT disabled. More specifically, we used a Pentium D 830 (3.0GHz) for the dual core tests and compared it to its single core counterpart - the Pentium 4 530 (3.0GHz).
First, we have our Winstone 2004 benchmark suite; we omitted Business Winstone 2004, since it shows virtually no performance boost from dual core CPUs and instead, focused on Multimedia Content Creation Winstone 2004 and the Multitasking Winstone tests.
While AMD scales slightly worse than Intel (comparing the AMD Dual Core to the Intel Dual Core rows) in the MMCC Winstone test and significantly worse in the Multitasking 1 test, AMD scales better in the last two tests. Particularly in the third multitasking test, AMD gets a whopping 68.4% from the move to dual core while Intel only improves by 39.1%.
It is also worth noting that although Hyper Threading improves performance with a single core, enabling HT on the dual core CPU actually yields lower overall performance than if we had left it off (+24.1% vs. +39.1%). Johan explained exactly why situations like this exist on the Pentium D in his "Quest for More Processing Power".
Next up is the SYSMark 2004 suite. In all but two of the tests, AMD scales slightly better than Intel when going to dual core. The scaling advantages aren't huge, but they are tangible in some of the tests.
Once again, while Hyper Threading itself tends to impress, HT + dual core gives us a mixed bag of results, sometimes outperforming dual core alone while falling behind other times.
Finally, we have our application-specific benchmarks; here, we have AMD scaling better than Intel in 3 out of the 5 tests, but then in the remaining 2, Intel scales better.
While the Athlon 64 X2 does have much better cache-to-cache transfer latencies than the Pentium D, it appears as if for the most part, those advantages don't surface in real-world desktop usage. That being the case, the Athlon 64 X2 3800+ must outperform the Pentium D 830 based on the performance advantages of its individual cores in order to win this battle, not based on any dual core architectural efficiencies. So, does it?
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masher - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
> "It is the core itself that increases the cost."True enough-- but a die twice as large shouldn't be over twice the cost...unless your defect rate is pretty high. With a high defect rate, a double-sized die doesn't mean half the yield..it means 1/3 or less.
Intel's dual-core dies are twice as large as their single cores...AMDs are a bit smaller due to the already-embedded HT glue. If the defect rates were anywhere close, then AMD should be able to sell dual-core chips for a smaller premium than Intel. Since they aren't (which likely means can't), we must assume they're still having a fairly high defect rate.
SDA - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
They could also just be charging a premium for the hot new thing. I suspect some of it has to do with AMD wanting to be known as high-end.. when people see Athlons in budget PCs all the time, Athlon becomes associated with budget.Defect rate works too, though. I'm just throwing out other possibilities. Either way, I think we can agree that the CPUs don't cost more because of slick interconnect technology.
krisia - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
Hmmm, hasn't AMD said they've planned for dual core all along and already had tech in their single core chips to support it? So, now they decide to charge for the tech? The thing anand fails to mention is that 40% more money for 10-20% performance gain is not a "clear choice". The choice is much less clear in fact, if you consider you can't buy a X2 3800 yet...SDA - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
40%? The X2 3800+ is supposed to cost $354, but the D 830 is $318 at NewEgg. That looks like a 10% price increase for a 10-20% performance increase AND a cooler processor. Seems like a fairly easy decision to me.If you are suggesting that the inability to perform basic arithmetic is a reason to get the Pentium D, I concur. ;)
krisia - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
If you did the math, then you'd know I was referring to the entry price for the D820. Which is the value entry into dual core? No?SDA - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
The AT review deals with the D 830, not the D 820. You used the numbers from the review and made your remark in the comments section of said review, and yet you feel it's obvious that you're referring to an unreviewed product even if you don't explicitly state such?Let's leave that behind us, though. There is a very simple flaw in your comparison: you're comparing SYSTEM performance differences to PROCESSOR price differences. How about comparing the build prices of an X2 3800+ to a comparably equipped (same amount of memory, same non-core components, all of that) D 820 system, then looking at the performance difference?
If you're too lazy to do the math (and in fairness, it's a PITA to add up components just for the sake of an argument) I'll just explain it simply: it's an 8-15% price boost for 10-20% better performance and a considerably cooler-running processor (and thus, if you plan the system properly, a quieter system).
Before you get defensive, I'm not trying to say that your 820 was a poor choice. I'm certain that you made the perfect choice for your situation. However, it is clear that the 3800+ is a good value in its intended niche.
krisia - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
Ok, the OP didn't reference the anandtech article, only the Pentium D lineup.It's just fun sometimes to do the unconventional or unpopular. :)
SDA - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
I bet it is. Just try to think everything out ahead of time so you don't end up unable to counter the last argument against your "unconventional or unpopular" view.Amplifier - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
First!Hacp - Tuesday, August 2, 2005 - link
I just read toms article and it had alot of synthetic benchmarks and very few real world benchmarks............... Except the ones that favor Intel........